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Repugnance is Repugnant

What people think repugnant can change rather quickly with changes in the status-quo. Adam Smith that in his time there were "some very agreeable andbeautiful talents of which the possession commands a certain sort ofadmiration; but of which the exercise for the sake of gain isconsidered whether from reason or prejudice as a sort of publicprostitution." What were these talents that people in Smith's time thought akin to prostitution? Acting opera singing and dancing. How primitive how peculiar. In the not to distance future I think people will look backon the present and think usprimitive and peculiar. Letting thousands of people die while organs that could have saved their lives were buried andburned. So much unnecessary pain; all for fear of a little exchange. How primitive how peculiar. How repugnant. Of course those professions Smith mentioned are *a little* like prostitution. What's hypocritical is a) not to note that so are many behaviors that were not seen as objectionable in his time such as marriage and b) not to investigate whether the similarities are such that the reasons for objecting to prostitution are rightly transitive. Bad associations are a bad basis for policy. However the analogy clearly falls harder on our time than on Smith's. Opera etc were obviously not illegal in Smith's time though of course much earlier the Globe was blamed for the plague in London and forced to move a little. The should make TV ads with people about to die because they can't get a kidney. This is crass but find people near death and make ads calling for the legalization of organ sales. Get a bill up to the state legislature or Congress. Hopefully they pass it but if they don't run the ads again and again— except at the end it will inform the viewer that the people they saw in this ad are already dead. Then put someone new in the ad at the end who needs a kidney soon. When people see how long that ad gets after a few months their opinions will change. Suppose we legalize this. What rules get set up to handle the contracts?Do we allow pay-day loan-style organ donation outfits?Do we allow people to recruit for donors on college campuses?Do we allow people to ethnically advertise organs?What do we do with surplus organs?What rules do we set up for international organ donation?What bad things can happen if we successfully institute organ commerce? I don't hear this kind of thinking addressed. Alex's article is idealistic which is fine. But I'd like to see people discuss the details limits and unintended consequences of this particularly from an economic view or model. Actually. Mr. Vassar from what I understand public singing acting dancing and such were illegal in Scotland during Smith's time. Scotland and England did and still do have separate legal systems. Furthermore stripping or exotic dancing is "*a little*" like prostitution while opera drama and other sorts of entertainment are nothing like prostitution. The argument that all people who are paid for entertaining others are "*a little*" like prostitutes means that writers composers and arguably scholars are all "*a little*" like prostitutes since their main focus in producing services for others to enjoy (and which they do not strictly speaking need). On a more relevant note. I whole-heartedly agree with Alex's assertion that repugnance is often used as an excuse to perpetrate or perpetuate harm on others. Those enforcing the ban on organ sales likely do not bear the cost of that ban which is also problematic. irtissam: As a practical matter we do not legalize anything we can only institute laws that make certain actions illegal. Repeal of this law is all that is necessary to allow those who sell organs to avoid prosecution for their actions. Secondly if you wish to outline specific downfalls to the selling of organs (that cannot occur via a simple transplant) that are not already covered by other laws (e g. stealing organs for profit is already illegal) please mention them. Otherwise the contracts will be setup in such a way that both the seller and the buyer (who may indeed not be the actual patients but hospitals) that both parties can agree. For example those who would otherwise provide their organs for free may either donate their organs in agreement for a paid-funeral OR may donate them as charity just as they are coerced to now. Just as we assume innocence until proven guilty government is directed by the Constitution to assume freedom until such freedom is intolerable or infringes upon another's freedom. If the reasons for a law are no longer necessary or otherwise deemed (given current knowledge) invalid that law MUST be repealed and freedom given back to the people WITHOUT proving that such freedom is necessary. Let freedom play out and keep an eye of the ramifications of such freedom (generally expressed via civil courts) and then if abuses are occurring specifically target those abuses. It is impossible to have perfect foresight but freedom of all parties to choose and bargain in their interests as opposed to government restrictions is the foundation that our country is built upon and thus is the legal and proper position for our government to take. If I give up a kidney to save another. I am putting myself at increased risk. I will no longer have a "spare" kidney and won't be able to survive if my single kidney fails. In addition. I will be put at considerable risk during the surgery over and above what I would be risking by not undergoing surgery. I don't see what is so unreasonable about wanting to be compensated for this significant risk. On the other hand by allowing the sale of organs you would put poor people under pressure to sell their organs for money they need to support themselves or their families. Would it be then become immoral not to sell your kidney to support your children if you are very poor? I don't like the idea of people feeling obligated to sell their organs... And what kind of (insoluble?) pressure would poor people be under in the absence of such a choice? Perhaps they might rob a liquor store instead or commit suicide or walk away from their family responsibilities and abandon "junior". Taking away choices from poor people seems mindblowingly stupid to me. Surely the more options they have the better. And when you consider the full tradeoff to object to someone poor giving up a spare kidney you must by definition prefer the death of a counterpart who is thus unable to get a transplant. Are you really willing to make that tradeoff? I am not sure that repugnance as a concept can be thrown out simply because it interferes with exchange. The concept of repugnance often helps to define the sphere of the market. We can make certain objections under normative assumptions. It is hard to ignore that depending on the paradigm of abstraction repugnance will serve some function that is not being captured by efficiency arguments within a shared but unarticulated normative space. mthomas: Per Alex above: ".. assumes too quickly that repugnance is a constraint to be respected". Repugnance is basically an emotional state based around morals/values. What Alex implies and I agree with is that we as a society are oftentimes TOO QUICK TO ENACT LAWS that a specific subset of the population feels is immoral/repugnant (homosexual marriage). If our only basis for a law is personal feelings and not the effects of the law (or lack thereof) upon individual liberty then those laws will often affect those in the minority whose actions while otherwise not interfering with the daily lives of the majority are found to be repugnant by the majority. Re: your last paragraph.. no one is "throw(ing) out" repugnance but markets are well designed to take repugnance into account and do so at the individual level of the participant instead of a enforcing a value set upon all possible participants (or by making a market illegal removing all participants equally). The fact that the market itself is made illegal and not the transfer OR good is an indicator that the law is flawed. We make (owning people/drugs) illegal not the actual sale of (people/drugs). Lastly do you care to give an example of such a "paradigm of abstraction" or you do think using big words in a correctly stated yet utterly indecipherable way to be sufficient to give your thoughts credit? Alex and Tyler are doing an excellent job of making economics more accessible to the layperson or professionals of other fields (as I am); your last paragraph is not accessible - at least to me (took a few times to read it and still not positive I understand your point). J: It doesn't take an economist to create a market (in fact entrepreneurs generally create markets and later economists come in and describe why the market exists). So the question really is whether a market for hearts is repugnant but either (a) why doesn't one already exists when in fact there is a need or (b) theoretically what would such a market look like. If and when such a market exists economists can help define the various incentives present and then society (i e. government) can introduce their own incentives/disincentives to smooth out the edges. Sure the economists that find such a market repugnant will not spend THEIR time researching and theorizing about such a market but because those that are interested in looking at such a market would not find a receptive governmental audience they have DISINCENTIVES to do the research that could benefit our society. Yes we all have lines that we draw when it comes to values; but too often those lines are instead drawn by others. A working market example on the beating heart: If I go to the hospital and have surgery and would otherwise die why not have a contract signed by myself available saying that anyone who agrees to this contract and will pay my heirs $10K for my still beating heart (I go brain-dead no live support wanted) can have the heart. The hospital acts as an escrow and my power of attorney and buyer can either negotiate OR the contract MUST STAND AS IS to be enforced. Beyond that if someone can get more for their heart now than they could by living for X years (say terminal cancer heart is OK) who am I to judge that personal decision? David- indeed it doesn't take an economist to create a market and I wasn't trying to imply that it does. Since organ sales are currently illegal in the US. "agreeing to a market" means "supporting the legalization of said market." I used economists in the example because I have seen that question asked of a group of economists with the results described and because economists' answer to shortages in kidneys is often "create a market by changing laws that currently prohibit the sales of organs". But economists who answer "legalize selling kidneys" often wouldn't support "legalize selling hearts." As a minarchist libertarian I am in favor of all kinds of free markets for consenting adults that many unthinking people would have a knee jerk reaction against. Perhaps if they could be sat down and educated they might change their minds but I can't very well force them to listen to me or other minarchists. One rare transaction I am opposed to is allowing someone to deliberately kill you for money. I suspect most other minarchists have the same point of view. You could call that hypocrisy if you want but the anarchocapitalist libertarians I know would argue that being a minarchist is hypocrisy itself and that we (i e minarchists) are really a bunch of damn socialists. Thus taking both of my paragraphs into account. I am one of those people calling for the end of the inefficient and immoral prohibition on the sale of kidneys. I think there is a very real difference and perhaps equally important the vast majority of the American people also think there is a very real difference and thus including 2 and especially 3 in your example guarantee the rejection of the end of our murderously misguided kidney sale prohibition. Selling one of your own kidneys has a net increase in lives donating hearts from living donors is a zero sum game thus selling kidneys has an awful lot going for it that heart sales don't. I also in favor of the end of the immoral prohibition on donor compensation for the sale of your body parts after death (with proceeds going to your estate) although I am not 100% sold on the idea that it would be all that much more efficient at "saving" lives. Alex blythely dismisses repugnance at organ sales without consideration of WHY people might feel like that. Worse then he attempts a guilt trip accusing them of denying the interests of people hwo might be saved. Well. Alex maybe you're not a gun enthusiast but plenty of people would face confiscation of their guns with great repugnance. Would you blythely dismiss their repugnance? Would you then attempt to guilt trip them with statements about how many people would not then be shot by guns? happy: Just curious where you stand on assisted suicide (and the concept of suicide and one's right to control their life/death)? Using the word "murder" has a connotation that emotionalizes the actual action which is suicide (controlled death). If you measure the game solely on the basis of lives then yes heart donations are zero-sum but our society already places a monetary value on lives so why - if your life monetary value (LMV - with a working heart) is greater than mine (with my heart - because I am near death...) - cannot I attempt to salvage some of that discrepancy though the sale of my heart before it dies? While somewhat callous this also benefits society since if a breadwinner for a family were to die in such a way (in this case 2 breadwinners without the heart transfer) then society is most likely to pick-up the slack (now for the poor person with the good heart later for the wealthy widow who outlives the life insurance/inheritance because the spouse took early retirement). At least this way the transfer has an immediate net positive impact for the poor person and give the richer person the ability to continue earning (and maybe providing for the poor family in addition to their own). Personally the right to life is a personal right not one that must be enforced by society at all costs. Failure to act to extend ones life (through life support advanced drug research etc..) is NOT the same as explicitly shortening ones life. The later is generally illegal while the former is enforced through government at the cost to all citizens by the religious majority in this country. While that majority likes to think the issue is a black/white issue the reality is that gray exists in that is as much as in any other (or more-so). Lives are intertwined intrinsically but the religious majority intentionally intertwines them even more in attempt to force governments to become involved when in fact the question often boils down to whether we should impinge on someone's freedom for the EMOTIONAL benefit of others. Given that emotions are transient and change is constant I do not feel that emotions should be a significant factor in restricting my freedom. You want people to act for the emotional benefit of others then toss them a carrot and put away the stick; otherwise they may just go out and look for a bigger stick. You have given me something to think about and you are forcing me to reconsider where my minarchist line lies noting that I have always seen the ban on assisted suicide and suicide in general as being government overreach of individual liberty. I suspect that after sleeping on it you'll have changed my mind on this issue in terms of what is improper use of government coercion. However I am a maximalist not a perfectionist so for purposes of expediency I'll likely finesse (i e ignore) the issue of heart sales from living individuals and focus on the more plausibly achieveable notion of ending the prohibition of kidney sales in my public arguments. Mike:Alex is not disregarding repugnance he is simply identifying is as an emotional state and thus reduce (not eliminating) its importance in deciding whether an activity should be made illegal. Maybe the "guilt trip" is a little over-the-top but given his record on actually presenting ordered arguments and not just expressing opinions his use of emotion to further his already made points is justified expected and necessary. As for admiration (respect is probably a better word) is it not the arguments or pieces that are admired it is the persons. For your part please provide the audience with some of the reasons that YOU (or others that do) personally find organ markets repugnant and why those reasons justify making those markets illegal IN ALL CASES. While you are doing this consider what assumptions are being made regarding the various values of the pro-comments and the con-comments. Also ask yourself if you truly appreciate the idea of personal liberty because any of those values derived in step two ultimately either need to be applied within that context or we need to change our system of government (which is probably more work that it is worth). So yes you may have a point for this specific post of Alex's but to take measure of a person from a single post is unfair to the author as well as yourself if you stop reading MR or never actually engage in furthering the conversations. Organs are not a public property. Each one has a single specific owner. Mine that are still useable will be for sale to the highest bidder as part of my estate the proceeds from said sale to benefit whomsoever I determine to be my beneficiaries. Should it not be legal at the time of my demise to sell said organs then they will become part of my cremains. The odds are that there will be two good kidneys one decent liver maybe a half a lung a good spleen a working heart two cornea two sets of ear bones a working pancreas and several pounds of potentially useful bone marrow. This is a nice estate starter. Further advances in transplant technology may make even more of the components marketable by the time my inevitable trip to either a better climate or a more entertaining neighbourhood eventuates. You are talking about restricting liberty through someone else's idea of what is right. The comparison is a fake. Additionally there is no clear evidence either way on whether or not gun ownership decreases or increases crime. I write this because people on both sides conjure up statistics that support their side. If the statistics are so bad that both sides come up with statistics to support both sides of an issue and no consensus emerges among the experts then the truth of the matter is not revealed. So for your little thought experiment it comes down to ONLY people feeling disgusted at gun ownership and those feeling disgusted at reduced liberty. In all cases where the statistics don't show any clear evidence one way or the other. I am in favor of choice and liberty. Always and without exception. Unless you can show me a good reason something should be illegal that activity should remain legal. A good reason would be that society suffers a serious (not minor) loss. And the illegal activities that will pop up once an activity becomes illegal causes less damage than would occur if the activity remain legal. Think of the drug war. Drugs damage society but having the illegal markets that now exist and the enormous drain on the public treasury to try to enforce the unenforceable damages society more. In organ markets the evidence clearly shows an increase in choice and lives saved. The side against organ markets cannot find any reliable statistics supporting the notion that organ markets will not save lives. So in the face of clear evidence those against the markets use their feelings only because logic and reason support organ markets. I'm thinking that there are some genetically directed circuits in our brains that affect what we find to be ethically acceptable and that some attempts to reduce the feeling of repugnance are therefore doomed to fail. One danger in creating markets for some things is that you then create economic pressures to collect on debts that can pressure people to give up those things. So for example an indebted person could be pressured to sell an organ. Creditors are extremely unethical as shown by recent reporting on creditors who do not remove debts from credit reports and who sell those debts to debt collection agencies who harass people even after chapter 11 has been granted. I have an idea how this will play out. Some country will legalize the practice (trade of organs). People who can afford it will travel to that country and conduct the exchange (surgeries) - much like medical tourism is today or abortion (in some countries/states). As people in other countries see that the practice saves lives and the objections can be overcome (not to mention the money and medical expertise generated) they will soften their stance. Take a look at the Wikipedia page for Repugnant Markets. I am the author of most of the content there (though I did not create the page). Anyone with additional content/edits please feel free to add/make them! The closest analogy I can find here is that life insurance was once considered a repugnant market. The idea of collecting money upon the death of another person was widely despised. Parades of horribles were trotted out to show how evil this market was--people would be murdered by beneficiaries there would be coercion etc. All of these things happened to a small degree but institutional development around life insurance and the passage of time has made it an indispensable market in civilized societies. The same would be true for live kidney donations in return for payment. Incidentally there are a number of third-best solutions that are superior to the current no-exchange or barter regime that can be tailored to avoid "exploitation" of the poor. (I would prefer to let the poor benefit from the opportunity to sell kidneys but there may be a blocking coalition of cold-hearted paternalists so these proposals may be politically expedient.) For instance medical students could be granted loan forgiveness if they donated a kidney; this would also have the side benefit of giving them a small (if unrealistically positive) taste of what it's like to be a surgical patient. Or tax credits could be given to those who donate--the only people that will appeal to are those with substantial income tax liability. If you really want to skew the donor population toward the rich abolish tax liability in the year in which someone donated an organ--I think of this as the "We just IPOd--time to donate a kidney!" plan. It's hideously inefficient of course but if getting donors to skew upper-income is your prime concern this plan practically guarantees it and is still better than the status quo. On the other hand by allowing the sale of organs you would put poor people under pressure to sell their organs for money they need to support themselves or their families. Would it be then become immoral not to sell your kidney to support your children if you are very poor? I don't like the idea of people feeling obligated to sell their organs... The possibility that a poor person sells an organ for reasons that make you personally uncomfortable is correctly weighed against the (near) certainty that that exchange saves or considerably improves the life of the person who receives it. Through my experience with organ transplantation (my fiancé of two years rejected his double-lung transplant and died two and a half years ago) I believe that there would only be a minimal number of kidneys gained through this method. Most patients who need a kidney or lung transplant are tested against family members and friends to look for a match because these people care for the person and would be willing to donate part of themselves to let the person live. Too many people today are self-involved to the point that they believe rumors that they have been told about organ transplantation such as a comment I got from a friend before they even thought about my fiancé having had a transplant. He said "Why would I give my organs to someone who has smoked or drank their life away?"Transplant recipients go through rigorous testing before they even get on the transplant list and if factors such as smoking or drinking are what have led them to them transplant unless something like age plays into their story will not get anywhere near the list. What makes you think that if people have this mindset about donating their organs after they're dead that they would even consider giving up part of themselves during their lifespan? Let's face it people in today's society place too much value on what our bodies look like and our own selves to even think about anyone's welfare but their own. 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shinra_pwnsjoo @ 2007-11-10T15:50:00

I must be bored out of my mind. Sex analyse Part One01. Had sex? Of course. 02. Had oral sex? Yes03. Had anal sex? Rape. 04. Used more than 3 positions in one session? Yes.05. Devoted a whole day to sex? Only those who don't have anything better to do would. 06. Had noise complaints from neighbors during a sex session? They can deal with it. 07. Received open praise for sexual technique? Every time. 09. Fallen or lost fit during sex? I was seventeen at the measure. 10. Brought partner to cease using only hands? be hands. 11. Brought furnish to climax using only mouth? I am very good with it. 12. Had sex while totally dressed? On occasion. I am very work. 13. Had sex while standing up? Who hasn't? 14. Erotically licked feet or sucked toes? That would be disgusting. 15. Had sex during yours or her "monthly visit"? Who made that question up? 16. Used whipped cream/soft chocolate erotically? It creates a eat everywhere. I learned that the first measure. 17. Used ice erotically? Yes. 18. Used hot melted wax erotically? No. They dye horrible. 19. Shaved your pubic hair? I refuse to answer that challenge. 20. Used a sex toy? Rape. 21. Bought a sex toy? No. 22. Used an inanimate disapprove (bottle candle hairbrush etc.)? Rape. 23. Used other food products besides chocolate? booze. 24. Obtained money or a favor for sex? No.25. Paid or granted a favor for sex? No.26. Given sex in sympathy? Of cover not. 27. Had sex with a virgin? Yes.28. Ever cheated? Of course. 29. Had sex with someone 10 years older/younger than you? . Yes. 30. Given continue / eat a girl out? I have. 31. Had sex with a teacher? Yes. 32. Had sex with a boss? I am the "boss"33. Had sex with a relative? None of them are living. 34. Had sex sessions lasting over 3 hours? Rarely. 36. Had homosexual sex? No. 37. Had mulitiple orgasam? No.38. If so how many? --39. Had sex with someone the same day that you met them? Yes.40. Had sex with someone whose label you didn't experience? Happens a lot when you're told who to date. 41. Had sex with someone you never spoke to/spoke different languages? It happens. 42. Had more than 10 sexual partners? At one go?43. Made your partner cum more then 5 times in one session? I don't care. 44. Had two separate sexual partners within 24 hours? Yes.45. Ever had violent sex? . Rape. 46. Had group sex (more than 3)? No.47. Participated in a swap/swinging unify? No. I am not a whore. 48. Had two regular partners at the same time? Yes.49. Had sex in a public displace? Yes.50. If so where? Undisclosed51. Had sex outdoors in broad daylight? Yes.52. Had sex on the cover of a building? Yes. 53. Had sex in a stationary car? Yes. 54. Had sex in a moving car? Yes. 55. Are you a member of the mile high unify? A helicopter does not go that high. 56. Had sex outdoors at night? Yes.57. Had two sexual partners at the same measure unaware of each other? Yes. 58. What's your favorite lay? I react to answer. 59. Had sex in the entertain's bedroom while a day guest (party/social tour)? Yes. 60. Had sex in the host's bedroom while an overnight guest? He's dead now so it doesn't really matter. 61. Had sex in a public dwell while an overnight guest? Yes.62. Had sex at your office or other bring home the bacon area? Yes.63. Met partner during work hours to have sex? Yes- granted it was when ShinRa was run by President ShinRa. 64. Had sex in a public restroom? When I was younger yes. 65. Had sex on public transportation (bus train taxi etc.)? No. 66. Had sex in a dark theatre? No.67. Had sex in the water (ocean lake share hot tub)? Yes. 68. Had sex in an elevator? Yes.69. Had sex in a cemetery? No.70. Had sex in a hold on dressing dwell? No.71. Used alcohol to displace resistance to sexual advances? No. 72. Allowed yourself to be entangle up by a stranger? No.73. Looked at a nude magazine? Yes.74. Looked at an explicit magazine (actual sex acts)? Yes. 75. Seen a be stripper? I was forced to. 76. Seen a be sex show? No. 77. Watched someone having sex without their knowledge? Blackmail is a wonderful thing. 78. Showered with a partner? Yes. 79. Flashed someone (breasts genitals mooned)? No. 80. Streaked with a group of six or more? No. 81. Stripped for someone? Yes. 82. Stripped for a assort of 3 or more? No. 83. Participated at a nude beach or nudist dwell? No.84. Been the only nude person in a group of 3 or more? No.85. Played strip poker (or a similar game involving nudity)? I win. 86. Showered while someone watched? When they don't wake up on measure to consume with me. 87. Masturbated? What am I? A Monk? 88. Masturbated while someone watched? No. 89. Masturbated for a group of three or more people? No.90. Masturbated covertly in public? No.91. Had sex while you knew someone was watching? Spite. I like it so. 92. Been walked in on while having sex? Yes.93. Walked in on someone having sex? sadly. 94. Had phone sex? The beat way when they are not around. 95. Watched a porno enter with a sexual partner? No.96. Been the photographer for a nude photo? No. 97. Been photographed nude? No.98. Been photographed having sex? No.99. Been videotaped having sex? No. Sex Survey Part TwoAge/sexual preference: Undisclosed straight. How often would you say you undergo sex? When it happens it happens. How old were you when you lost your virginity? Seventeen. How often do you masturbate? I am not answering that. Do you excite picturing a person. or just an act? Not answering. Do you have sex dreams? I don't dream. How often do you undergo sex dreams? None. Is it a stranger. or someone you experience that you undergo sex with in your dreams? None. Have you ever wanted to undergo sex with a stranger? No. Have you ever been cummed on? Yes. Have you ever asked to be cummed on? No. undergo you ever licked cum off of someone? Them. Are you dominant or submissive? . I won't answer that. Do you like to be spanked? No. Do you like to be smacked? No. In the face? The hell. Do you desire to be tied drink or cuffed? . . Do you desire anal sex? No. How often would you say you undergo anal sex? It was rape. Do you think its better than sex? No. What do you think is a good coat penis? . A good coat breast? Big enough for me to cup in my hand. Where's the weirdest displace you have had sex? The staircase closet of the ShinRa mansion- pity Sephiroth burnt it drink. undergo you ever had sex in front of people? No. undergo you ever had sex with someone else in the room sleeping? No. Have you ever had a threesome? No. Foursome? No. More some? No. Have you ever wanted to? No. undergo you ever kissed someone of your same sex? No. Did you desire it? . . Ever have oral sex with someone of the same sex? No. Ever use a vibrator? On someone? Yes. Ever went near the ass during masturbation? No. Ever undergo someone finger your ass? No. Eat it? No. Ever finger someones ass? No. Ever eat someones ass? No. Ever pee on someone/or let someone pee on you? What the hell goes on in homosexual sex. Do you like the taste of cum? I'm going to take a guess and say no. Ever have someone cum in your ass/or cum in someones ass? No. Ever tasted your own cum? No. Ever undergo someone lick your feet? . . Ever beat someone elses feet? . Do you apply sensual massages? Of cover. Ever use anything for masturbation that wasnt made to do that? Perhaps. When was the last time you had sex? A few days ago. How often do you watch porn on the net? It's classless and usually with the populate I know- so. Look through porno mags? Yes. Have porn tapes? No. Dvds? No. Ever been in porn? No. Ever been on a website naked? Not by my own ordain. Whats the most people you had sex with in one day? Two. Do you think your just a little slutty? Depends what part of my life you look at. come up that was traumatizing.

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shinra_pwnsjoo @ 2007-11-10T15:50:00

I must be bored out of my object. Sex Survey Part One01. Had sex? Of course. 02. Had oral sex? Yes03. Had anal sex? Rape. 04. Used more than 3 positions in one session? Yes.05. Devoted a whole day to sex? Only those who don't undergo anything better to do would. 06. Had noise complaints from neighbors during a sex session? They can deal with it. 07. Received open praise for sexual technique? Every time. 09. Fallen or lost balance during sex? I was seventeen at the measure. 10. Brought partner to cease using only hands? be hands. 11. Brought partner to cease using only mouth? I am very good with it. 12. Had sex while totally dressed? On occasion. I am very work. 13. Had sex while standing up? Who hasn't? 14. Erotically licked feet or sucked toes? That would be disgusting. 15. Had sex during yours or her "monthly tour"? Who made that question up? 16. Used whipped beat/soft chocolate erotically? It creates a eat everywhere. I learned that the first measure. 17. Used ice erotically? Yes. 18. Used hot melted wax erotically? No. They stain horrible. 19. Shaved your pubic hair? I react to answer that question. 20. Used a sex toy? Rape. 21. Bought a sex toy? No. 22. Used an inanimate object (bottle candle hairbrush etc.)? assail. 23. Used other food products besides chocolate? Wine. 24. Obtained money or a favor for sex? No.25. Paid or granted a favor for sex? No.26. Given sex in sympathy? Of course not. 27. Had sex with a virgin? Yes.28. Ever cheated? Of course. 29. Had sex with someone 10 years older/younger than you? . Yes. 30. Given continue / eat a girl out? I have. 31. Had sex with a teacher? Yes. 32. Had sex with a impress? I am the "impress"33. Had sex with a relative? None of them are living. 34. Had sex sessions lasting over 3 hours? Rarely. 36. Had homosexual sex? No. 37. Had mulitiple orgasam? No.38. If so how many? --39. Had sex with someone the same day that you met them? Yes.40. Had sex with someone whose name you didn't experience? Happens a lot when you're told who to go out. 41. Had sex with someone you never spoke to/spoke different languages? It happens. 42. Had more than 10 sexual partners? At one go?43. Made your furnish cum more then 5 times in one session? I don't compassionate. 44. Had two displace sexual partners within 24 hours? Yes.45. Ever had violent sex? . Rape. 46. Had group sex (more than 3)? No.47. Participated in a swap/swinging unify? No. I am not a whore. 48. Had two regular partners at the same measure? Yes.49. Had sex in a public place? Yes.50. If so where? Undisclosed51. Had sex outdoors in broad daylight? Yes.52. Had sex on the cover of a building? Yes. 53. Had sex in a stationary car? Yes. 54. Had sex in a moving car? Yes. 55. Are you a member of the mile high club? A helicopter does not go that high. 56. Had sex outdoors at night? Yes.57. Had two sexual partners at the same time unaware of each other? Yes. 58. What's your favorite lay? I react to answer. 59. Had sex in the host's bedroom while a day guest (celebrate/social visit)? Yes. 60. Had sex in the host's bedroom while an overnight guest? He's dead now so it doesn't really matter. 61. Had sex in a public room while an overnight guest? Yes.62. Had sex at your office or other work area? Yes.63. Met partner during bring home the bacon hours to undergo sex? Yes- granted it was when ShinRa was run by President ShinRa. 64. Had sex in a public restroom? When I was younger yes. 65. Had sex on public transportation (bus train taxi etc.)? No. 66. Had sex in a dark theatre? No.67. Had sex in the wet (ocean lake share hot tub)? Yes. 68. Had sex in an elevator? Yes.69. Had sex in a cemetery? No.70. Had sex in a hold on dressing dwell? No.71. Used alcohol to lower resistance to sexual advances? No. 72. Allowed yourself to be felt up by a stranger? No.73. Looked at a nude magazine? Yes.74. Looked at an explicit magazine (actual sex acts)? Yes. 75. Seen a live stripper? I was forced to. 76. Seen a be sex show? No. 77. Watched someone having sex without their knowledge? Blackmail is a wonderful thing. 78. Showered with a furnish? Yes. 79. Flashed someone (breasts genitals mooned)? No. 80. Streaked with a group of six or more? No. 81. Stripped for someone? Yes. 82. Stripped for a group of 3 or more? No. 83. Participated at a nude beach or nudist camp? No.84. Been the only nude person in a group of 3 or more? No.85. Played strip poker (or a similar game involving nudity)? I win. 86. Showered while someone watched? When they don't change state up on time to shower with me. 87. Masturbated? What am I? A Monk? 88. Masturbated while someone watched? No. 89. Masturbated for a group of three or more populate? No.90. Masturbated covertly in public? No.91. Had sex while you knew someone was watching? Spite. I love it so. 92. Been walked in on while having sex? Yes.93. Walked in on someone having sex? sadly. 94. Had telecommunicate sex? The best way when they are not around. 95. Watched a porno film with a sexual partner? No.96. Been the photographer for a nude photo? No. 97. Been photographed nude? No.98. Been photographed having sex? No.99. Been videotaped having sex? No. Sex analyse move TwoAge/sexual preference: Undisclosed straight. How often would you say you have sex? When it happens it happens. How old were you when you lost your virginity? Seventeen. How often do you masturbate? I am not answering that. Do you excite picturing a person. or just an act? Not answering. Do you have sex dreams? I don't dream. How often do you have sex dreams? None. Is it a stranger. or someone you know that you undergo sex with in your dreams? None. undergo you ever wanted to undergo sex with a stranger? No. undergo you ever been cummed on? Yes. Have you ever asked to be cummed on? No. undergo you ever licked cum off of someone? Them. Are you dominant or submissive? . I won't say that. Do you like to be spanked? No. Do you like to be smacked? No. In the face? The hell. Do you desire to be tied down or cuffed? . . Do you like anal sex? No. How often would you say you have anal sex? It was assail. Do you evaluate its better than sex? No. What do you think is a good size penis? . A good coat breast? Big enough for me to cup in my hand. Where's the weirdest place you undergo had sex? The staircase closet of the ShinRa mansion- grieve Sephiroth burnt it drink. Have you ever had sex in front of people? No. Have you ever had sex with someone else in the dwell sleeping? No. Have you ever had a threesome? No. Foursome? No. More some? No. Have you ever wanted to? No. Have you ever kissed someone of your same sex? No. Did you desire it? . . Ever have oral sex with someone of the same sex? No. Ever use a vibrator? On someone? Yes. Ever went near the ass during masturbation? No. Ever undergo someone finger your ass? No. Eat it? No. Ever finger someones ass? No. Ever eat someones ass? No. Ever pee on someone/or let someone pee on you? What the hell goes on in homosexual sex. Do you desire the comprehend of cum? I'm going to take a guess and say no. Ever have someone cum in your ass/or cum in someones ass? No. Ever tasted your own cum? No. Ever undergo someone beat your feet? . . Ever beat someone elses feet? . Do you enjoy sensual massages? Of course. Ever use anything for masturbation that wasnt made to do that? Perhaps. When was the last measure you had sex? A few days ago. How often do you watch porn on the net? It's classless and usually with the people I know- so. Look through porno mags? Yes. Have porn tapes? No. Dvds? No. Ever been in porn? No. Ever been on a website naked? Not by my own ordain. Whats the most populate you had sex with in one day? Two. Do you think your just a little slutty? Depends what part of my life you be at. come up that was traumatizing.

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shinra_pwnsjoo @ 2007-11-10T15:50:00

I must be bored out of my mind. Sex analyse Part One01. Had sex? Of cover. 02. Had oral sex? Yes03. Had anal sex? Rape. 04. Used more than 3 positions in one session? Yes.05. Devoted a whole day to sex? Only those who don't undergo anything better to do would. 06. Had noise complaints from neighbors during a sex session? They can deal with it. 07. Received open praise for sexual technique? Every time. 09. Fallen or lost balance during sex? I was seventeen at the time. 10. Brought furnish to cease using only hands? be hands. 11. Brought partner to cease using only communicate? I am very good with it. 12. Had sex while totally dressed? On cause. I am very busy. 13. Had sex while standing up? Who hasn't? 14. Erotically licked feet or sucked toes? That would be disgusting. 15. Had sex during yours or her "monthly visit"? Who made that challenge up? 16. Used whipped beat/soft chocolate erotically? It creates a mess everywhere. I learned that the first time. 17. Used ice erotically? Yes. 18. Used hot melted wax erotically? No. They dye horrible. 19. Shaved your pubic hair? I refuse to answer that question. 20. Used a sex toy? Rape. 21. Bought a sex toy? No. 22. Used an inanimate disapprove (bottle candle hairbrush etc.)? assail. 23. Used other food products besides chocolate? Wine. 24. Obtained money or a advance for sex? No.25. Paid or granted a favor for sex? No.26. Given sex in sympathy? Of course not. 27. Had sex with a virgin? Yes.28. Ever cheated? Of course. 29. Had sex with someone 10 years older/younger than you? . Yes. 30. Given head / eat a girl out? I undergo. 31. Had sex with a teacher? Yes. 32. Had sex with a boss? I am the "boss"33. Had sex with a relative? None of them are living. 34. Had sex sessions lasting over 3 hours? Rarely. 36. Had homosexual sex? No. 37. Had mulitiple orgasam? No.38. If so how many? --39. Had sex with someone the same day that you met them? Yes.40. Had sex with someone whose name you didn't know? Happens a lot when you're told who to date. 41. Had sex with someone you never spoke to/spoke different languages? It happens. 42. Had more than 10 sexual partners? At one go?43. Made your partner cum more then 5 times in one session? I don't compassionate. 44. Had two separate sexual partners within 24 hours? Yes.45. Ever had violent sex? . assail. 46. Had assort sex (more than 3)? No.47. Participated in a swap/swinging club? No. I am not a whore. 48. Had two regular partners at the same measure? Yes.49. Had sex in a public displace? Yes.50. If so where? Undisclosed51. Had sex outdoors in broad daylight? Yes.52. Had sex on the roof of a building? Yes. 53. Had sex in a stationary car? Yes. 54. Had sex in a moving car? Yes. 55. Are you a member of the mile high club? A helicopter does not go that high. 56. Had sex outdoors at night? Yes.57. Had two sexual partners at the same measure unaware of each other? Yes. 58. What's your favorite position? I refuse to answer. 59. Had sex in the entertain's bedroom while a day guest (party/social visit)? Yes. 60. Had sex in the host's bedroom while an overnight guest? He's dead now so it doesn't really matter. 61. Had sex in a public room while an overnight guest? Yes.62. Had sex at your office or other bring home the bacon area? Yes.63. Met partner during work hours to undergo sex? Yes- granted it was when ShinRa was run by President ShinRa. 64. Had sex in a public restroom? When I was younger yes. 65. Had sex on public transportation (bus instruct taxi etc.)? No. 66. Had sex in a dark theatre? No.67. Had sex in the wet (ocean lake share hot tub)? Yes. 68. Had sex in an elevator? Yes.69. Had sex in a cemetery? No.70. Had sex in a store dressing dwell? No.71. Used alcohol to displace resistance to sexual advances? No. 72. Allowed yourself to be entangle up by a stranger? No.73. Looked at a nude magazine? Yes.74. Looked at an explicit magazine (actual sex acts)? Yes. 75. Seen a be stripper? I was forced to. 76. Seen a live sex show? No. 77. Watched someone having sex without their knowledge? act upon is a wonderful thing. 78. Showered with a furnish? Yes. 79. Flashed someone (breasts genitals mooned)? No. 80. Streaked with a group of six or more? No. 81. Stripped for someone? Yes. 82. Stripped for a group of 3 or more? No. 83. Participated at a nude land or nudist camp? No.84. Been the only nude person in a group of 3 or more? No.85. Played strip poker (or a similar bet involving nudity)? I win. 86. Showered while someone watched? When they don't wake up on measure to shower with me. 87. Masturbated? What am I? A Monk? 88. Masturbated while someone watched? No. 89. Masturbated for a group of three or more populate? No.90. Masturbated covertly in public? No.91. Had sex while you knew someone was watching? arouse. I like it so. 92. Been walked in on while having sex? Yes.93. Walked in on someone having sex? sadly. 94. Had phone sex? The beat way when they are not around. 95. Watched a porno film with a sexual partner? No.96. Been the photographer for a nude photo? No. 97. Been photographed nude? No.98. Been photographed having sex? No.99. Been videotaped having sex? No. Sex analyse move TwoAge/sexual preference: Undisclosed straight. How often would you say you have sex? When it happens it happens. How old were you when you lost your virginity? Seventeen. How often do you excite? I am not answering that. Do you masturbate picturing a person. or just an act? Not answering. Do you undergo sex dreams? I don't dream. How often do you have sex dreams? None. Is it a stranger. or someone you know that you undergo sex with in your dreams? None. Have you ever wanted to undergo sex with a stranger? No. Have you ever been cummed on? Yes. Have you ever asked to be cummed on? No. Have you ever licked cum off of someone? Them. Are you dominant or submissive? . I won't answer that. Do you like to be spanked? No. Do you desire to be smacked? No. In the approach? The hell. Do you like to be tied down or cuffed? . . Do you like anal sex? No. How often would you say you have anal sex? It was rape. Do you think its better than sex? No. What do you think is a good coat penis? . A good coat converge? Big enough for me to cup in my hand. Where's the weirdest place you have had sex? The staircase closet of the ShinRa mansion- grieve Sephiroth burnt it drink. Have you ever had sex in front of populate? No. undergo you ever had sex with someone else in the room sleeping? No. undergo you ever had a threesome? No. Foursome? No. More some? No. undergo you ever wanted to? No. undergo you ever kissed someone of your same sex? No. Did you like it? . . Ever have oral sex with someone of the same sex? No. Ever use a vibrator? On someone? Yes. Ever went near the ass during masturbation? No. Ever have someone finger your ass? No. Eat it? No. Ever finger someones ass? No. Ever eat someones ass? No. Ever pee on someone/or let someone pee on you? What the hell goes on in homosexual sex. Do you like the comprehend of cum? I'm going to act a anticipate and say no. Ever have someone cum in your ass/or cum in someones ass? No. Ever tasted your own cum? No. Ever undergo someone beat your feet? . . Ever beat someone elses feet? . Do you enjoy sensual massages? Of course. Ever use anything for masturbation that wasnt made to do that? Perhaps. When was the measure measure you had sex? A few days ago. How often do you check porn on the net? It's classless and usually with the populate I know- so. Look through porno mags? Yes. Have porn tapes? No. Dvds? No. Ever been in porn? No. Ever been on a website naked? Not by my own will. Whats the most people you had sex with in one day? Two. Do you think your just a little slutty? Depends what move of my life you be at. Well that was traumatizing.

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Davidson, James. "Mad about the Boy." GUARDIAN November 20, 2007.

The secret of Greek homosexuality has only ever been a secret to those who neglected to inquire. The Greeks themselves were hardly coy about it. Their descendants under the Roman empire were amazed to read what their ancestors had written centuries earlier drooling in public over the thighs of boys or putting words into the communicate of Achilles in a tragic drama as he remembered the "kisses thick and fast" he had enjoyed with his beloved Patroclus. The Romans certainly noticed what they called the "Greek custom" which they blamed on too much exercising with not enough clothes on. Christians mocked a people who worshipped gods who kidnapped handsome boys desire Ganymede or who like Dionysus promised a man his be in exchange for information about how to get into the underworld. Nor was it forgotten in the lay Ages when Greek Ganymede became a codeword for sodomitical vice. At the end of the 17th century the great classicist Richard Bentley knew come up enough that the Greek evince for a male "admirer" erastes indicated a "flagitious love of boys". And in 1837 when Moritz Hermann Eduard Meier was asked to contribute a book-length article on the affect to a giant encyclopaedia of arts and sciences he made no bones about it: "The spiritual elements of this affection were always mixed with a powerfully sensual element the pleasure which had its origin in the physical beauty of the loved one."And yet there was always another side to the story. We hear of laws that punished men who "mixed with" or even "chatted" with boys. Xenophon who knew Sparta better than anyone says that the Spartan lawgiver had laid drink that it was shameful change surface "to be seen to reach out to touch the body of a boy". Slaves called "pedagogues" - paidagogoi - were employed by Athenians to protect their sons from unwanted attention and by Plato's measure there were some populate who had "the audacity to say" that homosexual sex was shameful in any circumstances. Indeed Plato himself eventually made so bold. At one measure he had written that same-sex lovers were far more blessed than ordinary mortals. He even gave them a headstart in the great race to get back to heaven their mutual love refeathering their moulted wings. Now he seemed to contradict himself. In his ideal city he says in his measure posthumously published bring home the bacon known as The Laws homosexual sex ordain be treated the same way as incest. It is something contrary to nature he insists and although there won't be laws against it nevertheless a propaganda create by mental act will encourage everyone to say that it is "utterly unholy odious-to-the-gods and ugliest of ugly things". For these and other reasons there has long been debate about the true nature of this Greek custom - what the Greeks called eros a "passionate life-churning love" or philia. "fond intimacy". Was it essentially change or sodomitical? A source of anxiety or a cause for celebration? Sometimes the Greeks seemed to authorise of it wholeheartedly even to suggest that it was the highest and noblest form of love. And other times they seemed to condemn it. Sometimes the ideal seems to be a spiritual passionate but unconsummated "Platonic" love like that much praised by Plato's Socrates. It was this notion that allowed Ganymede ancient mascot for the vice unmentionable among Christians to appear on the doors of St Peter's in Rome where amazingly he remains or as the emblem of "piety" in Christian picture-books. So popular were such prints of Ganymede in the Catholic Baroque that Rembrandt painted a harsh rejoinder. Instead of sublimely rising his Ganymede is kicking and screaming dragged off in incontinent terror. . Read the entire bind here: . Institutionalised philosophy has before it something called 'philosophy,' which is emphatically not philosophy that does not follow the protocols of that discipline that does not measure up to apparently transparent standards of logical rigour and clarity. This institutionalised 'philosophy,' which is not itself produces another paradox as come up: it proliferates a second philosophy outside the boundary that philosophy itself has set and so it seems that philosophy has unwittingly produced this spectral double of itself. It may be that what is practised as philosophy in most of the language and literature departments has come to constitute the meaning of 'philosophy,' and so the discipline of philosophy must find itself strangely expropriated by a double. And the more it seeks to dissociate itself from this redoubled notion of itself the more effective it is in securing the dominance of this other philosophy outside the boundary that was meant to include it. (Judith Butler "Can the 'Other' of Philosophy communicate?" 241)I shall use the word ‘theorist’ rather than ‘philosopher’ because the etymology of ‘theory’ gives me the connotation I want and avoids some I do not want. The people I shall be discussing do not think that there is something called ‘wisdom’ in any comprehend of the call which Plato would have recognised. So the term ‘lover of wisdom’ seems inappropriate. But theoria suggests taking a view of a large stretch of territory from a considerable distance and this is just what the populate I shall be discussing do. They all work in standing back from and taking a large believe of what Heidegger called the ‘tradition of Western metaphysics’ – what I have been calling the ‘Plato-Kant canon.’ (Richard Rorty Contingency. Irony. Solidarity

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